The Dating Papers - Latest Comments in Who Should Pay On A First Date?

Re: Who Should Pay On A First Date?

Seth — Sun, 01 Mar 2009 21:40:38 -0000

@neal - spoken like a true pick-up-artist.

I'm a bigger fan of actually admitting to interest and building a relationship on a foundation of trust instead of churning through a fuck-and-leave machine because I'm scared of loving and losing.

Re: Who Should Pay On A First Date?

Neal — Sun, 01 Mar 2009 20:08:09 -0000

You don't take her to dinner. The dinner date is too strong a signal you're interested and blows the chance for any mystery. You do something free or low cost, low expectations, easy for both, and of limited duration. Have tea or coffee for an hour, then bolt. This is to screen, build trust, and build attraction. It's all about escalation. Start small then build to consummation. I would actually avoid the dinner date until after you have consummated. Then whoever asks pays. Or better yet, cook her a meal. It doesn't take much to learn a few sure fire recipes that will make you seem like an expert bachelor.

Re: Who Should Pay On A First Date?

Seth — Fri, 27 Feb 2009 15:14:10 -0000

@Nakia

"suggesting" going Dutch seems to be emerging as a common way of telling a date they suck.

Which is too bad because it blurs the line between independent and uninterested. It also reinforces my feeling that the pay-for-play mentality is far more deep-seated than most are willing to admit.

Re: Who Should Pay On A First Date?

Nakia — Wed, 25 Feb 2009 23:45:15 -0000

For me, I think whoever asks should be the one to pay (in most situations).

I've done a fair amount of asking myself and have no problem paying for dinner, drinks & tip.

If I'm not having a good time or I'm just totally uninterested in the person, I always suggest going Dutch.

Re: Who Should Pay On A First Date?

Seth — Mon, 23 Feb 2009 11:51:02 -0000

Bob: I've had exactly that happen to me and it was a lot of fun!

I like how you make it clear that you need not be impressed right from the start. I think we'd all do very well to do that. =)

Re: Who Should Pay On A First Date?

Bob — Sun, 22 Feb 2009 22:20:55 -0000

The answer is simple: the person who asks pays.

I have had no problem letting women pay when they asked me out. As a male, I don't feel any less manly if I allow a woman to pay. In fact, it is flattering and feels nice to be treated once in a while. :-)

That being said, when a woman asked me out, if I accepted, I let her know upfront that a simple walk would be sufficient. That way, she wouldn't feel obligated to spend a lot of money to impress me.

Re: Who Should Pay On A First Date?

Seth — Sun, 22 Feb 2009 16:01:55 -0000

Hi Paul!

To the contrary, being last on the list is usually just as good as being first when it comes to having your comment read!

Paying for desert and coffee, just as you would for a friend or co-worker, is not a question of equality but simple nicety. I think many of us put a lot less weight on who pays for coffee and dessert than we do on who pays for dinner.

I like your plan. It allows you to start on even footing without any "debt" on either side while giving a bit of room for your old school charm to shine through in the end. Good for you! =)

Re: Who Should Pay On A First Date?

Paul — Sun, 22 Feb 2009 15:07:37 -0000

Nobody will read this, because there are so many comments but...
As a man, it has been my practice to split the dinner bill and then pay for coffee and dessert afterwards.

This seems to work because it allows both of us to participate in a dating gesture without making me resentful of paying for an expensive dinner and her feel strangely obligated.

And yes, if you are going to claim that women are equal to men, you can not have your cake and eat it too!

But in my mind, paying for the dessert and coffee is a necessary nod to the "tradition of Western culture" in which we unfortunately live and date in.

Re: Who Should Pay On A First Date?

kelli — Fri, 13 Feb 2009 19:56:50 -0000

as far as the insist-a-split hint -- you may have something of a keeper there. I'm not the only girl I know who does the same thing -- I think what links us is a desire to not ever lead someone into having the wrong impression. Some girls will just let the guy pay and never intend to return his call when he asks her out again. I just know that I would never want to be treated that way... so I don't treat others that way.

Guys -- if you are arm wrestling a girl for the bill, you may have a problem... I'm jus' sayin'...

Re: Who Should Pay On A First Date?

Seth — Fri, 13 Feb 2009 08:20:00 -0000

@Mike

Yes, I see how it is a "part of Western Culture" but like many aspects of our culture, I don't believe it is something that needs to continue.

The argument that something is a part of a culture has allowed us to neglect needed changes in many parts of the world to the detriment of millions and what should be our own deep shame.

@Kelli:

As long as there's a genuine offer to split the check, I think the point has been made that nobody is being bought.

However, you and many others say that you insist on splitting the check when you don't like the guy. Do you think this is a common enough practice to actually go in "the book of hints"?

Seth

Re: Who Should Pay On A First Date?

kelli — Fri, 13 Feb 2009 03:25:19 -0000

LOL
this underlines my post on how confused we all are as a country on who pays for the date. I'm just big on being gracious, thoughtful and aware... many of your readers were aware of uncomfortable pauses, situations and expectations and handled it graciously and THEN made the decision on whether or not they were going to go on date #2.

Personally and not as someone who writes a dating blog -- I look for generosity, respect and intent when deciding on a second date.
--Any guy who expects nooky because he bought something is off my reservation. Immediately.
--I'll admit to insisting on the split only when I am decidedly not interested in the guy.
--And when interested, I usually find a way to pay for something -- a coffee afterwords, the movie tickets, the taxi fare... something to acknowledge that I do not expect a free ride but am interested in seeing where it goes.
--The only rule I follow is that whoever initiates the date needs to expect to pay. And yes, I have asked guys out in the past AND payed for the whole date.
--And Seth, yes, I also almost ALWAYS offer to split. If he accepts, I do tend to assume that it was not a love connection and we are both on to the next.

Re: Who Should Pay On A First Date?

Mike Masters — Fri, 13 Feb 2009 01:24:52 -0000

When I first moved to Japan i had the delightful experience of having the girl pay or go dutch. I think this was because it is so expensive for young people that it impossible not to do so! Not only that but Valentines day if a holiday for men!! (the next month is white day, a reverse holiday)
This seeming flip flop of male female roles was a whole lot of fun but I found myself wanting to revert to my chivalrous American upbringing. I would pay for the first day and we would rotate.
I agree with Tom that a lot of men pay in hopes of having her "owe" them and hopefully get sex but not all and it does not mean I will stop paying for the first date!
Unfortunately the man paying really is a part of western culture and to not role with it and make the best of it is as bad as putting ketchup to your sushi.

Re: Who Should Pay On A First Date?

Seth — Fri, 13 Feb 2009 00:36:47 -0000

@Jim

I'm enjoying getting to know some of the crazy stories that have made up your life so far!

It takes a lot of heart to go with that "hunch" and leap into a relationship feet-first with your heart open.

You have my respect!

Re: Who Should Pay On A First Date?

Seth — Thu, 12 Feb 2009 20:20:51 -0000

@Jim: No, it doesn't sound corny at all! You really moved in without dating..roommates?

Re: Who Should Pay On A First Date?

bobby — Thu, 12 Feb 2009 17:47:54 -0000

Seth, you are the first to tell me that-PURIST? I like it :)
You see the delema then? Most agree that communication is very important, yet we all can't agree on something fairly simple like who pays on a date and why.

I think the usual "Who invites pays" is a good general rule that can, if we all understand this rule, resolve the question and yet still allow wiggle room.

"Hey Seth, I know you invited me but I really would like to pay for this date, ok?"

No matter how you answer the problem is solved.

Bobby the purist :)

Re: Who Should Pay On A First Date?

Seth — Wed, 11 Feb 2009 18:31:02 -0000

@Jim: I agree with your summary of missing intimacy. You say you initially had no money but your wife had some. How did that affect where you went on dates/what you did?

You were able to figure things out and make them work. That counts for a lot!

Re: Who Should Pay On A First Date?

Seth — Wed, 11 Feb 2009 16:24:29 -0000

@Maggie: I have had the best dates while getting coffee or grabbing something in one of those "dives" you mention. It's really supposed to be about the people involved, as far as I'm concerned. You know? When we're 85 and tired of talking to each other, lets go to fancy places to eat, okay?

@Susan: That's the kicker. You've got to mean it! I owe you dinner at some point!

Re: Who Should Pay On A First Date?

Susan Mazza — Wed, 11 Feb 2009 16:12:57 -0000

The person who asked. But you should never assume so I think the person invited should always offer (and mean it!)

Re: Who Should Pay On A First Date?

Seth — Wed, 11 Feb 2009 14:56:00 -0000

Ap: Nicely said! It's good to be straightforward. If you scared them off, then it's not like they're somebody you'd be able to be yourself around anyhow, yes?

Guilt isn't any fun at all. I'm with you on that. Unless it's because you had 18 slices of chocolate cake...in which case I might feel guilty, but I'll laugh about it! =)

Re: Who Should Pay On A First Date?

Apples — Wed, 11 Feb 2009 14:43:46 -0000

I've decided, dutch can be complicated if one has cash the other doesn't or so forth. If its just going to be one date then dutch I will offer. So if I like something depending on the situation I will offer to pay totally, if he insists or just pays before I offer I will tell him Thank you and inform him next time we go out its on me. Or something like that.

I am a bit of a prude I well not be having sex on the 1st 4th -or whatever the "rules" say- date.

And I don't want even the slightest sort of that guilty/obligated feeling. But I am pretty blunt so chances are I will have scared them off by the second date HAHA!

Re: Who Should Pay On A First Date?

Gorillamonk — Wed, 11 Feb 2009 14:24:32 -0000

Go dutch, its a lot easier.

Re: Who Should Pay On A First Date?

Seth — Wed, 11 Feb 2009 14:09:34 -0000

Rashaun: If you go whitewater rafting on first dates, you must be quite the time! The ask/pay policy is what I do with my friends. It makes sense to do the same with the people I'm hoping to be even more than friends with!

Re: Who Should Pay On A First Date?

Rashaun Integral Apparel — Wed, 11 Feb 2009 14:07:08 -0000

I think who ever initiates the date or brings up where to go. If I asked my date to go White Water Rafting for her first time, I would assume I would be paying and vice versa!

Re: Who Should Pay On A First Date?

Seth — Wed, 11 Feb 2009 14:06:45 -0000

Kelly: Haha! Not a matter of pride if you've got it settled ahead of time. I say we use the economy as an excuse to focus more on communication and less on expenditures during dates! =)

Max: Nice plan! I'm a fan of lunch dates simply because you can actually get to know somebody without much of the stress that's attached to evening dates!

Re: Who Should Pay On A First Date?

maxsilver — Wed, 11 Feb 2009 13:55:25 -0000

I think it depends on a few things. If it is a dinner, then whoever asked should pay. If it is a lunch, I think it is more acceptable to split. If a number of drinks are bought then whoever asked should get the food bill, but split the drink bill. If the one who didnt as is dead set on splitting, then have the other pay the tip